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Will Mario Wii U Be Enough?

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  • Will Mario Wii U Be Enough?

    Earlier this week, Shigeru Miyamoto revealed two of the Wii U games Nintendo will have on display at E3 2012: a new Mario adventure and Pikmin 3. Further comment from the company confirmed these plans, and specified that the Mario game would be based on the prototype shown at E3 2011, which featured a 2D, New Super Mario Bros.-esque approach combined with the presence of Miis. Nintendo also registered SuperMario4.com, lending more support to some sort of 2D-styled platformer.

    Though it's too soon to tell if Nintendo intends both of these games to be ready for the launch of Wii U, both seem to have been in development for some time. We know Nintendo has been working on Pikmin for years, and the Mario demo was at last year's show, and conceptually wouldn't seem to need a lengthy development time. At this point, it would be more surprising if the games didn't make the launch of the system – or its release window.

    But will they be enough? While Mario's last several adventures have burned up the charts, the prospect of returning to the 'New' approach yet again isn't too enticing. Meanwhile Pikmin, which certainly has plenty of potential on Wii U, never found a sizable audience. Either way, it seems like two games won't be enough for Nintendo.



    From a historical sales perspective, Mario makes the case that his next game will give Wii U strength. The Nintendo 3DS's fortunes were reversed when two games hit worldwide – both starring Nintendo's mascot. As of earlier this year, Super Mario 3D Land and Mario Kart 7 are the two best-selling titles in the 3DS's lifespan, selling 5 and 4.5 million copies respectively. The first New Super Mario Bros. game, on the DS, still stands as that system's biggest seller, with 26 million units sold. In terms of Nintendo's home console, all three major Mario titles for Wii have performed incredibly well. Looking at statistics released at the end of 2011, New Super Mario Bros. Wii has accumulated an astonishing 25 million units sold, ranking just behind Wii Play, Mario Kart Wii and the Wii Sports titles as one of Wii's all-time best-sellers. Super Mario Galaxy has racked up over 10 million units and its sequel, Super Mario Galaxy 2, cleared 6 million copies sold.

    Yet of all Nintendo's demonstrations at E3 2011, the 'New Super Mario Bros. Mii' one was the least impressive. Aside from being able to shift the sample levels to the Wii U's controller, there wasn't much substance to what we played – or any real innovation for that matter. Granted, that was no doubt a starting point for a much larger experience, but we're somewhat reserved that an enhanced New Super Mario Bros. is going to be so impressive that it attracts the kind of attention that a launch window Mario game demands. To be completely honest, the 'New Mario' experience on DS and Wii, although certainly entertaining, always felt a bit stripped of some of the magic that makes Mario games so endearing. Gone were some of the most interesting power-ups, level designs and challenges that made even the most seasoned gamers break a sweat. They were, in a sense, 'Mario Lite', despite their quality in craftsmanship (and innovations, like co-op multiplayer on Wii). For meatier experiences, we still had to wait for the Galaxy entries and 3D Land.

    Bring on the power-ups and world maps from Mario 3 and Mario World. Bring on the insane, outlandish level designs from the Galaxy games. Bring on Yoshi, the Koopalings, the difficulty and the fresh concepts that have come to define so many iconic Mario adventures. While some of these elements were certainly present in the 'New' titles, we're looking for all of this, plus the innovation of Wii U and the creativity of 3D Mario adventures. Nintendo's last couple 2D Mario games were charming because of their retro flavor (and multi-player entertainment), but once the novelty wore off, there was something missing. We weren't as stunned as we were with the Galaxy titles - or 3D Land, for that matter.

    All of that makes us wonder if Mario will accomplish all the Wii U needs it to. The E3 2011 demo failed to impress us not just for its 'New Mario' feel, but because it really didn't strain the imagination. Having a semi-portable home console experience is great, but it's not stunning. It's hardly the stuff that will make us drop the $300 or so that Nintendo will no doubt ask. (And if Nintendo's most dedicated fans resist, how will more casual consumers react?) If what we've played, both last year as well as on Wii and DS, sums up the majority of the Mario experience Nintendo is preparing, there's substantial cause for concern – at least for those waiting for (and needing) proof that Wii U will deliver a new way of gaming.



    Perhaps predictably, Pikmin would seem to be in the opposite position. The franchise has never really set fire to the sales charts, with the first installment barely sliding past 1 million units sold globally and the second never even seeing a Wii upgrade here in North America. Yet as Nintendo's answer to a real-time strategy game, Pikmin is a perfect candidate to prove the value in having a second, touch-enabled screen built into a home console's controller. One of the few genres that PCs command almost exclusively is now open to Wii U owners. Add in HD graphics and Pikmin could be a real powerhouse – assuming Nintendo can market it properly.

    Therein is Pikmin's weakness – it doesn't entirely match up with Nintendo's "bring the hardcore back" messaging. Pikmin definitely falls in line with everything else the publisher does. That's not good or bad – it's just the reality of the situation. Pikmin hits explored territory, and doesn't necessarily find the audience that Nintendo has supposedly lost on its quest to court casual players. There's no reason to suggest Nintendo needs to suddenly dig deep and find its M-rated roots, but Pikmin isn't likely, no matter how innovative it is, to really turn heads.

    Whatever versions of Mario and Pikmin appear at E3 2012, they're likely to be good. The pedigree of both franchises has long been established. But will either title provide the kind of support Wii U actually needs? Mario, if it is based largely on the demo we saw, wouldn't seem poised to convince people to buy a system, even if its predecessors lit up the sales charts. There certainly wasn't much that had us running to our friends and families the way we did with Super Mario Galaxy or Wii Sports. At last year's E3, New Mario Bros. Mii was the last game we mentioned when talking about the potential of the system. Pikmin has an even steeper climb, being a title that doesn't fit Nintendo's branding needs, nor being an established hit that (most) fans eagerly anticipate. Unfortunately it's also the one that could prove the concept of Wii U. But what good is that if no one buys it?

    Will either title really step beyond the formulas we've seen in iterations past? Will Nintendo still need to find more? Will these games be enough to establish Wii U in the minds of the millions that bought its predecessor? Those are the sorts of questions that stir in our minds as Nintendo's critical showing creeps closer. They are, yet again, indicative of the pressure that looms on the horizon, as Nintendo faces intense scrutiny over its strategy towards the ever-changing video game market.

    E3 2012 is less than seven weeks away…

  • #2
    Super Mario 4 in the old classic 2D style would be dope ...the same goes for a new Super Mario Galaxy
    My 2PAC Collection | Status: 09/27/2018
    Vinyls: 60
    Cassettes: 110
    CDs: 216


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    • #3
      Depends on which target group. I cant understand for hardcore gamers is not enough. For me, this would be far from enough.

      but hey, im not really a big Nintendo fan.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Big Exodus View Post
        Super Mario 4 in the old classic 2D style would be dope ...the same goes for a new Super Mario Galaxy
        super mario galaxy 3 would be AWESOME. a true super mario rpg sequel would be freaking amazing as well. i agree with [MENTION=856]LarsVerb though this is not enough, but this at launch, and a Zelda HD, plus 3rd party support will make the Wii U THE system to have

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        • #5
          Originally posted by 007 View Post
          super mario galaxy 3 would be AWESOME. a true super mario rpg sequel would be freaking amazing as well. i agree with [MENTION=856]LarsVerb though this is not enough, but this at launch, and a Zelda HD, plus 3rd party support will make the Wii U THE system to have
          not for me. I am not a fan of nintendo games, expect a few.

          The WII U have nearly the same graphics as PS3 and xbox now. And the Ps3 is not even at his max now. Plus the playstaion have better exclsuives for me. So I will wait for Ps4.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by LarsVerb View Post
            not for me. I am not a fan of nintendo games, expect a few.

            The WII U have nearly the same graphics as PS3 and xbox now. And the Ps3 is not even at his max now. Plus the playstaion have better exclsuives for me. So I will wait for Ps4.

            actually the Wii U has MUCH better graqhics than the ps3 or xbox 360, as confirmed by multiple sources. it was something like 300 or 400% better. Neither the PS3 or xBox can do true 1080 graphics, the Wii U can, easily. The new xbox is only 20% more powerful than the Wii U and I wouldnt expect the PS4 to be much better. Graphics are a VERY small part of what makes a game for me anyways. I will take Mario Galaxy 2 with its vivid graphics in 480p over 720 or even 1080 BF3 ANY DAY. If i want something to look realistic, I will go out in the real world and do it. When I play video games, I want the gameplay, NOT graphics. The PS4 will also probably be 600 dollars or more for the first few years.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by 007 View Post
              actually the Wii U has MUCH better graqhics than the ps3 or xbox 360, as confirmed by multiple sources. it was something like 300 or 400% better. Neither the PS3 or xBox can do true 1080 graphics, the Wii U can, easily. The new xbox is only 20% more powerful than the Wii U and I wouldnt expect the PS4 to be much better. The PS4 will also probably be 600 dollars or more for the first few years.
              na lol. I heard alot 3rd party developers that said the oposite lol.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by LarsVerb View Post
                na lol. I heard alot 3rd party developers that said the oposite lol.
                no EVERYONE has said it is much better except for that group of 3rd party developers who bashed it, and later were discovered to be microsoft devs. get your facts straight i been following Wii U very closely. The system has a much better GPU, more RAM, and better CPU. The only problem that has come about is in PORTING games to the Wii U to make graphics better. NEW games will look much better than PS3.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by 007 View Post
                  no EVERYONE has said it is much better except for that group of 3 3rd party developers who bashed it, and later were discovered to be microsoft devs. get your facts straight i been following Wii U very closely.
                  I have red alot interviews were people say the oposite lol. The WII U 300% or 400% times better then ps3, cmon Josh wake up

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by LarsVerb View Post
                    I have red alot interviews were people say the oposite lol. The WII U 300% or 400% times better then ps3, cmon Josh wake up
                    wake up? 3 or 4 times better than 7 year old hardware and I should wake up? you should just admit you are one of the idiots who thinks nintendo is for kids, but you are wrong. the ps3 and 360 were both much mroe than 4 times more powerful than their predecessors, so why wouldnt the new generation be the same? 300-400 PERCENT = 3 or 4 x more powerful. It actually could be alot more.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by 007 View Post
                      wake up? 3 or 4 times better than 7 year old hardware and I should wake up? you should just admit you are one of the idiots who thinks nintendo is for kids, but you are wrong. the ps3 and 360 were both much mroe than 4 times more powerful than their predecessors, so why wouldnt the new generation be the same?
                      I dont think its for kids, I just dont like the games lol. Thats something different. I must confirm the Wii was for kids yea hhahahah.

                      We both dont know the true, lets see it when its released.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by LarsVerb View Post
                        I dont think its for kids, I just dont like the games lol. Thats something different. I must confirm the Wii was for kids yea hhahahah.

                        We both dont know the true, lets see it when its released.
                        lol your like this guy who was bashing an article on IGN this morning about nintendo, saying the games are all stupid and for kids, then posts that he's a "real man" because of his games list, which was literally nothing but COD, battlefield, killzone, gears of war, halo, etc etc.

                        I am 26 years old and think Mario Galaxy 1 and 2, Twilight Princess, and Skyward Sword were 4 of the the top 10 games of this generation, maybe even top 5. All for wii. Does that make me a kid?

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by 007 View Post
                          lol your like this guy who was bashing an article on IGN this morning about nintendo, saying the games are all stupid and for kids, then posts that he's a "real man" because of his games list, which was literally nothing but COD, battlefield, killzone, gears of war, halo, etc etc.

                          I am 26 years old and think Mario Galaxy 1 and 2, Twilight Princess, and Skyward Sword were 4 of the the top 10 games of this generation, maybe even top 5. All for wii. Does that make me a kid?
                          oyes you are!

                          you know i am not random mainstream gamer like that IGN dude lol.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by LarsVerb View Post
                            oyes you are!

                            you know i am not random mainstream gamer like that IGN dude lol.
                            I'LL SHOW YOU A KID!!!

                            /ban LarsVerb

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                            • #15
                              The Wii U is doomed to the same fate as the Wii for a few simple reasons.

                              1) Nintendo is just now finally catching up to the Xbox 360 and ps3. While the Wii U will be more powerful at launch, most estimates I've seen have the system only moderately more powerful then current hardware. With the whole system costing only $180 in parts to Manufacture (Most of which is going into the controller again) it simply isn't realistic to expect a console that's going to be able to compete with the inevitable Next Box and PS4. Could it be 300% more powerful then the Xbox 360 or Ps3? Perhaps... But consider that these systems are from 2005/2006. I wouldn't expect anything less then a 300% increase after 7 years. To put things in perspective, the Playstation Vita is technically more powerful then anything currently on the market but thus far we haven't seen anything that can really show this power off.

                              2) The Controller will ultimately be Nintendo's undoing. Personal feelings aside, the controller is what Nintendo is banking everything on, it's what they're touting as the next big thing and are going to use to differentiate themselves from the other systems. Never mind the fact that as of last E3 Nintendo themselves went on record and stated that only 1 controller would be connected to each console and they had no intent on selling replacement controllers in stores. Since then the Big N has been at work trying to figure out a way to use more then one controller per console, and I'm confident we'll hear that the Wii U now supports 2 touch screen controllers at this years E3, but that will come with a serious cost to the console... Reduction in quality of game design, graphics, physics, and overall support. Nintendo's own first party software will likely be good to borderline excellent, and the first 2 years MIGHT be interesting for 3rd party developed games, however in the long run Nintendo has only screwed themselves with this design decision. For starters, Developers are going to want to port their games to the most systems, meaning with the big 3 in place, only 1 currently uses a touch screen controller. So if only 1 system uses this technology, you're not going to sink the same amount of time and energy into getting the most out of it as you would if all 3 used it. At it's best, I'd expect that most 3rd party games wil use the screen as a HUD or Map... at it's worst... well... anyone remember the VMU?

                              3) Developers aren't going to develop for Nintendo first. As alluded to in point number 2, the controller is already going to be limited in it's touchscreen support since only one console will use it. However even more problematic is that when the inevitable successors to the ps3 and xbox launch, they're going to eclipse what Nintendo will be able to do. So what happens then to the Wii U? It gets downgraded ports of games that are designed for either the ps4 or Next Box. It happened this generation with the ps3, and it will happen again next generation to Nintendo. Now I'll admit that in theory, Nintendo could shock the industry and become the front runner, however given Nintendo's restrictive nature, abysmal online support, and archaic policies regarding many key parts of the current video game market, it's HIGHLY improbable that Nintendo will do any better next generation then it did this generation as there are plenty of accounts from developers stating their dislike for the way Nintendo does business.

                              4) Miyamoto. Perhaps one of the greatest minds to ever work in the video game industry, his works are the most highly regarded and memorable of all Video game legacy's. Personally, I'd place the characters he's created in such high regard that they are more like-able and memorable then even those of the Disney brand. However for as Great as Miyamoto was (in the 80's and 90's) he's now the #1 problem with the Nintendo company. Miyamoto has failed to progress beyond what he did in the mid 90's. It's as if he just gave up after Mario 64 and Ocarina of time. Zelda is still essentially the exact same experience that fans played for the first time in 1998, and even that was only moderately different from what we first played on the NES and SNES. In 1998 Ocarina of Time was a truly memorable experience, riding Epona, going fishing, and just exploring the world was new and exciting. However since then we've seen the core ideas miyamoto introduced expanded and elaborated on to such a degree that New Legend of Zelda titles seem like an outdated antique before it even hits market. If the Legend of Zelda is to survive it needs to evolve. The Elder Scrolls titles have demonstrated very clearly what is expected in an adventure title. For starters, we need a true open world. No more trying to fake it by creating a large world that a player cannot do anything in until the correct time in the game.

                              Every Legend of Zelda game has followed the same pattern: Find sword, Purchase Shield, Find Heart Container, Fight Boss, Find Heart, Find Boomerang, Find Heart Container, Find Better Sword, Fight Boss, Find Bombs, Find Heart container, Fight Boss, Find Hookshot, Find Heart Container, Find Magic, Find Heart Container, Fight Boss, Find Bow & Arrow, Fight Boss, Find Master Sword, Find Heart COntainer, Fight Gannon/Final Boss.

                              The Legend of Zelda needs to take a page from the Elder scrolls, we need true open world go anywhere environments that don't restrict the player until they've acquired a specific item, there needs to be NPC's that people actually care about, and as startling as it may be, characters MUST speak. Following in this example, Miyamoto needs to hand the reins of Mario over to someone else. I think it's extremely well documented that People want a true sequel to Super Mario World. The Mario games have always been fantastic (I own every one and in many cases multiple versions of each one) however the past several (yes even Mario galaxy) have lacked the creativeness of the games from the 80's and 90's. I've seen AMAZING custom levels online and fantastic ideas through a variety of communities, but these thoughts and ideas fall on deaf ears as Miyamoto feels he still knows what people want, and to be blunt he doesn't. For anyone doubting my thoughts on Miyamoto I only need to point to Miyamoto's last 3 "original" ideas...

                              Wii Fit Anyone?


                              or Maybe Wii Music?


                              or Better yet, the Wii Vitality Sensor


                              It's obvious even to the most ridiculous of fanboy's that Miyamoto's time has past, and it's time for him to take on a different role at Nintendo and hand creative control over to younger artists.

                              The Wii U certainly has potential, and it's undoubtedly going to be a success (though I doubt it will come anywhere near the total number of sold units that the Wii did), however it's basic premise and design is flawed to the point that it can't possibly hope to be the "it" console. Will I purchase it? Of course, I own every mainstream console since 1981, however that doesn't mean it will get a lot of use. I've owned my Wii since April 2006 yet only play it a handful of times per year, and even then it's only for the latest Mario Game. Meanwhile My Xbox 360 see's weekly if not daily use and my game library for that system alone is pushing 200 games. The wii has proven that there is a casual market of video game fans, however it's also proven that this market alone cannot sustain your profits/console. Nintendo need's the core gaming market and until they recognize that and stop catering to 5 year old and 85 year old's, they will never be anything other then 3rd in the console race.

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